Shrinking videos from Missa!

[Obsidian Reaver]

No offense taken, I assure you. And I hear your points loud and clear.

However, folks just as often jump on the "This is WONDERFUL" bandwagon, and offer nothing more than effusive praise without specifics. I'm guilty of it myself. The point, though, is that no one gives two nickels about that. No one. But do the opposite and say "meh" without elaboration? No less than three members instantly went on an "Oh no you DIDN'T" attack. Seriously. (Even if you didn't mean to come off like that, that's how it very appeared).

Hypocrisy. And I don't like it. If Missa's put off by a general negative comment, then she might want to pack up her studio right now, because if she can't handle something as benign as "I didn't like it;not my thing", then she stands NO chance against truly nasty comments.

I mean, he even said the process was "really good", just not his cup of tea. He came off as respectful. It was an honest opinion given in response to the subject matter at hand.

You don't have to worry about Missa closing up shop just because someone didn't care for a commissioned clip. I think, given the overwhelming level of praise she's received from the vast majority of us, she knows we highly value her as both an artist, and as a member of this community.

[qzar9999]

I would point out a couple of important things:

Specific details are less important to praise, as you can assume you did something right even if the response is simply "I like it." Whereas "I didn't like it" is entirely useless without elaboration; you know it didn't appeal but you don't know how to fix it.

Also, while he may have said the process was good, he gave it a 4/10. That's pretty bad. I've reviewed a lot of products in my time, and if i gave something that low of a rating I'd feel obligated to explain why it wasn't even halfway decent.

I don't think anyone here assumes that Missa has such a fragile ego that she can't handle any criticism. It's just annoying and useless to leave that kind of feedback.

[Obsidian Reaver]

Originally Posted by qzar9999

I would point out a couple of important things:

Specific details are less important to praise...

No. Honestly, no. "I like it" is okay, but "I didn't like it" isn't? Come on now, that's a bit disingenous I think.

Also, while he may have said the process was good, he gave it a 4/10. That's pretty bad. I've reviewed a lot of products in my time, and if i gave something that low of a rating I'd feel obligated to explain why it wasn't even halfway decent.

The point is, he's not obligated to give details. If it's okay to just say "that's great", then "I didn't like it" is just fine too. And so what if he gave it a 4/10. Big deal. He's like the only one on here who disliked it.

And if you want to get REALLY picky about it, he *did* give the criticism that the process wasn't long enough.

Long story short, I think a few of you owe that member an apology. Jumping all over members who dare voice a difference of opinion in a respectful manner is NOT a good way of keeping this forum healthy and a place where folks can discuss their fetishes with like-minded individuals. You know you erred, now the right thing to do is to admit it and correct your mistake.

And then we can all go about our fetish-loving business.

[vincent_richter]

I give your comment a 2 out of 10. Do better.

[Obsidian Reaver]

Originally Posted by vincent_richter

I give your comment a 2 out of 10. Do better.

Lol, come on now.

[vincent_richter]

Originally Posted by Obsidian Reaver

Lol, come on now.

Why? It's every bit as valid an opinion as his.

[Obsidian Reaver]

You know what I mean.

[Rei-Lin]

Look, it doesn't matter what I say Reaver, you're just going to disagree to disagree at this point. I didn't tear the guy up I simply wanted him to explain his reasons or else don't say anything. I'm fine with opinions if I understand why you have that opinion. Missa told me why the guy didn't like it and he probably would have felt embarrassed admitting it on these forums, but the point is if he had said "it's not my thing because 'blah blah blah' I could have seen that it was purely a kink related opinion and not something Missa did "wrong" and I'm fine with that. I draw anime styled characters, and there's a bunch of people I know who like my art but will never really "like' my art because they hate Anime and everything it stands for. I can live with that but I'd be pretty upset if I didn't know that was their reason and would feel like a failure for not being able to please people.

Finally, there's a reason why I rarely ever do a video review anymore. Believe it or not, a lot of people on these forums never speak up or write anything, but they do read reviews and that in turn can effect the sales on clips from these producers. They all have the numbers when it comes to sales and I've been shown the numbers. I've been shown that sales were going steady at one point, then I post a review on these boards, and suddenly they stop. This happens from negative comments, even small insignificant ones to you or me and it's not just on this board.

Now does this mean these companies have disappeared because of some negative comments? No, not yet and they probably won't, but it still hits them in the pocket books nevertheless. When you think of how much money goes into these clips with only maybe 20 to 25 people on this entire board actually buying anything, even 2 or 3 people no longer interested in buying it due to some negative comment they read could have an impact on the producer. And I'm not just talking about Missa here either.

But hey it's the internet and comments and opinions are going to fly regardless of what I say or do. I'd like people not to post negative comments without a basis as to why something is wrong in their eyes, but if they do they do. Anyway, I'm now done with this subject as I've spoken my peace and given my thoughts and opinions. If you agree then you agree and if you don't, then you don't.

[Obsidian Reaver]

Originally Posted by Rei-Lin

Look, it doesn't matter what I say Reaver, you're just going to disagree to disagree at this point. I didn't tear the guy up I simply wanted him to explain his reasons or else don't say anything. I'm fine with opinions if I understand why you have that opinion. Missa told me why the guy didn't like it and he probably would have felt embarrassed admitting it on these forums, but the point is if he had said "it's not my thing because 'blah blah blah' I could have seen that it was purely a kink related opinion and not something Missa did "wrong" and I'm fine with that. I draw anime styled characters, and there's a bunch of people I know who like my art but will never really "like' my art because they hate Anime and everything it stands for. I can live with that but I'd be pretty upset if I didn't know that was their reason and would feel like a failure for not being able to please people.

Finally, there's a reason why I rarely ever do a video review anymore. Believe it or not, a lot of people on these forums never speak up or write anything, but they do read reviews and that in turn can effect the sales on clips from these producers. They all have the numbers when it comes to sales and I've been shown the numbers. I've been shown that sales were going steady at one point, then I post a review on these boards, and suddenly they stop. This happens from negative comments, even small insignificant ones to you or me and it's not just on this board.

Now does this mean these companies have disappeared because of some negative comments? No, not yet and they probably won't, but it still hits them in the pocket books nevertheless. When you think of how much money goes into these clips with only maybe 20 to 25 people on this entire board actually buying anything, even 2 or 3 people no longer interested in buying it due to some negative comment they read could have an impact on the producer. And I'm not just talking about Missa here either.

But hey it's the internet and comments and opinions are going to fly regardless of what I say or do. I'd like people not to post negative comments without a basis as to why something is wrong in their eyes, but if they do they do. Anyway, I'm now done with this subject as I've spoken my peace and given my thoughts and opinions. If you agree then you agree and if you don't, then you don't.

Your peace is noted.

Do I agree with it? No, but as you stated, I don't particularly have to.

Good health to you, Rei-Lin.

[qzar9999]

Originally Posted by Obsidian Reaver

No. Honestly, no. "I like it" is okay, but "I didn't like it" isn't? Come on now, that's a bit disingenous I think.

You may have noticed I went on to explain exactly WHY I felt that one was ok but the other wasn't. Or perhaps you chose to ignore my supporting argument and attack only my initial statement?

Originally Posted by Obsidian Reaver

Long story short, I think a few of you owe that member an apology. Jumping all over members who dare voice a difference of opinion in a respectful manner is NOT a good way of keeping this forum healthy and a place where folks can discuss their fetishes with like-minded individuals.

If my response had simply been "You didn't like it? What the fuck is wrong with you, you idiot?" then maybe so, but I didn't respond how I did strictly because he didn't like it. As I said before, he's entitled to his opinion and a negative opinion is just as valid as a positive one. What irritated me is that he gave it a very bad review with no useful feedback for what was wrong or how it can be improved. As Rei-Lin said, bad reviews can hurt sales numbers (Missa and other producers have said this themselves), so it's important to them to know how to avoid bad reviews in the future. "This wasn't to my personal tastes, 4/10" doesn't help in any way. Granted, he did technically say the process was too short, but that's about it; given that it's nearly 25% of the video I have to wonder where he's coming from on that, but he did say it. I don't think most people would have considered that complaint enough to give it such a bad review, though. On technical merit alone this video is easily above average.

Originally Posted by Obsidian Reaver

You know you erred, now the right thing to do is to admit it and correct your mistake.

...yeah that's not how I see it at all. I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree, here. You seem like a good guy overall, OR, I don't really wanna keep going around on this with you.

[Obsidian Reaver]

Originally Posted by qzar9999

You may have noticed I went on to explain exactly WHY I felt that one was ok but the other wasn't. Or perhaps you chose to ignore my supporting argument and attack only my initial statement?

Ignore your supporting argument? Attack your initial statement? You're making me out to sound like some kind of master strategist of linguistics! I assure you, I am not. lol

My plan was never to do any of that. I saw your supporting argument, but I simply rejected on the grounds that it was, indeed, disingenuous.

...you know it didn't appeal but you don't know how to fix it.

That alone is enough to form a valid opinion. If I don't like something, even if I don't know how to do it better, I'll say so! I don't have to elaborate on anything, especially if you don't.

Example:
Person 1: I like that car.
Person 2: I don't like that car.

Both perfectly valid, neither requiring any further elaboration.

Example 2: What happened here.

Person 1: WOW, that was some video!
Person 2: Truly Missa is one talented person. Keep the clips coming!
Person 3: Yet another awesome clip. Probably the best shrinking clip I've seen. I enjoyed the part where she went flying the most.

***Bear in mind, these are example statements meant to be representative of the actual statements found on this thread (I'm not going through and cutting and pasting all the actual statements. Too long a process). They're pretty close to accurate.***

Person 4: Meh, I didn't like it. Some parts of it were pretty good, but I just don't care for it.

Person 1, 2, & 3: YOU need to provide rationale behind your claim, Person 4! You rate it that low?! Outrageous. If you don't have anything nice to say about the clip, WHY comment at all on it??? It's not as though this is some kind of forum for expressing one's opinion!

***End example***

Do you see what I'm driving at here? No one said jack shit when the praise was flowing. We were all circle-jerking each other over the genius that is Missa (again, her work is REALLY, REALLY GOOD. I'm not saying it's crap. Missa is one fine producer of content, and we're lucky to have her as a member here). The moment someone offers the flip-side, the claws come out. Rather than accept his view on the subject, as we've been accepting the other positive one's, you imposed some ridiculous edict on him that he MUST explain his position, or he shouldn't have posted at all.

Again, hypocrisy. And again, I don't like it. That's how you drive people off.

And you're right, Missa isn't some fragile individual who's going to shut down everything because someone respectfully didn't like the video. So why are you all acting like you have to silence negative reviews? Any intelligent person can read through all the reviews, good and bad, and come to their own conclusion whether the clip is worth parting hard-earned money for. And given that the positive things said about the clip FAR outnumber the one or two "meh" comments, I think the clip will sell just fine.

This isn't something unique to this particular clip, either. I've seen it happen with other threads as well.

What irritated me is that he gave it a very bad review with no useful feedback for what was wrong or how it can be improved. As Rei-Lin said, bad reviews can hurt sales numbers (Missa and other producers have said this themselves), so it's important to them to know how to avoid bad reviews in the future.

See the above novel I wrote. lol

I will add, though, that it's virtually impossible to avoid all negative reviews, particularly one's where the person just didn't like the content (which, honestly, isn't really a review at all. If a potential customer likes the content, they're not going to be swayed by someone who "doesn't" share their interests anyway).

...yeah that's not how I see it at all. I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree, here. You seem like a good guy overall, OR, I don't really wanna keep going around on this with you.

I can respect that, sir. I have no wish to make an enemy out of you or anyone else for that matter.

I can agree to disagree.

Besides, arguing over the interwebz is some kind of self-destructive, cardinal sin, isn't it? Best we stop while we're both ahead. lol

[qzar9999]

Perhaps I've simply spent too long on Amazon and GameFAQs, where reviews are expected to elaborate and have the "helpful/unhelpful" thing on them. And this is why it's not a good idea to have high expectations for the internet. ^_^

Yeah, online arguments aren't truly worth perpetuating. We'll call it a day and leave this thread to discussion of the actual worth of the clip, yes?